Friday, June 3, 2011

Creationism: good-bye reason, here comes the stupid (by anon)

To disagree or not to disagree? Either way, shut up.

There's something that's been bugging me lately. Whenever there is some philosophical discussion a religious person tends to attack science or say it's "bullshit." Being a sciencey person, I base my beliefs on the scientific method and that statement just sparks a flare to the brush that is my intolerance for blatant deadlocked ignorance.

In our group of friends, we were having a conversation the other day. Just having a couple brews with the bros, one very good friend, who was raised by a baptist pastor his whole life, observed that, "radio carbon dating is total bullshit with zero reliability. It's not even science." I tried to explain that carbon dating itself only gives a wide range of the age of material which is why when the test is performed it includes radio xenon dating, phosphorous dating, nitrogen dating, basically a huge variety of elements until it can be narrowed down to a reasonable time range based on the radio isotopes which work much the same way a radio active clock works with elements decaying at a very constant consistent manner. But before I could get past 'carbon dating is' I was cut off with my friend saying that his dad showed videos of this guy who travels around to highschools to have afterschool debates with teachers who embrace evolution. I've seen one of these videos with my buddy a long time ago and needless to say, the guy is good at arguing. But he doesn't debate with our professors or anyone with a PHD. Frankly, in the one I saw the teacher was blown out of the water. But it IS a highschool teacher. Educated, but this one in particular was not charismatic and couldn't handle being bull rushed by a hot blooded southern baptist with the rage of God that children are being taught nonsense and blasphemy.

Here's my beef. If you're a firm believer that the universe is 6,000 years and 6 days old and you find yourself in an argument, especially with someone who knows what they're talking about, about evolution or the sort, then you need to say "My strength in faith is more powerful than my faith in science" and end it there. Otherwise you'll get in a circular argument trying to justify your countless hours of religious practice and your sciency antagonator, no matter how slow and calm he speaks, will make so much sense that it offends you.

It's not impossible for both religion and science to be trusted. You can combine, intertwine, and pick and choose your accumulated beliefs from each side but naturally if you take the bible literally and not as a fiction story you find a few irregularities between what it says and what someone with a doctorate who studied the earth for 50 years will say. It’s probable to disagree with people who have been indoctrinated with malice aforethought that they will literally repudiate justification that is right in front of them. If you see me holding a hundred dollar bill in front of a mans face and he says it's not there, what do you think? You think he's blind or crazy? He might already be a block away running with it or he's the world's most intelligent philosopher about to drop a bomb and mind fuck you silly. Or you just think he's an idiot. And this is what creationists have been doing; they have been literally denying justification that is right in front of them, aren’t they? These people are so adamant about holding these so-simply-answered preconceptions that they have altered the clarification of the word evidence. Creationists have a garland of theories with a raise of what they call contribution regarding those theories, yet they can't see that their arguments don’t rest on proof or rationality they just have a really great publicist.

“To disagree with a male who has renounced his reason is like giving disinfectant to the dead.”  ~Thomas Paine


  1. What a dumb post. You can say that creationists are giving up on reason all you want. but when it comes down to it, the creationists are moving and changing this country more than those of you who think you are so reasonable. Like it or not, the creationists are winning the debate. Do you not see it right in front of your face? some of the most popular and important people in America are creationists. And who are you?

    1. You're such a dork. Creationists have gaping holes in logic and evidence. Genesis chapters 1-12 weren't even written as if they were literally true. They were written as mythology because that was just how people wrote back then. I am so amazed that people who love their Bible so much don't even know how to read it properly, accounting for the different genres of writing. This undercuts the Creationists' fundamental motivation for their view, for without that flawed interpretation of the Bible, they wouldn't be arguing for such a ridiculous young earth view.

      And this has nothing to do with the heaping amounts of evidence that the universe is much much much older than 6000 yrs. It's willful ignorance to discount all the evidence.

  2. You know, it's not just religious people that question science. Or do we have to pick sides when it comes to religion vs. science?

  3. You cannot pick and chose between science and religion. The two are incompatible period. Believe what you want to believe but don't assume that religion and science are compatible. They are not! Creationism is not taught in any colleges or high schools in the US. That is how much credibility it has among educated people in the US. It is nothing more than a nice fairy tale for adult children. College students should have more sense than getting behind this nonsense. Start reading some books and learn more about science. There is no excuse for ignorance especially among college students!

  4. Creationsits may actually be winning the "debate" in the US. But, fortunately, that doesn't have any baring at all what is actually true. All they succedd in doing is making the US look like an ignorant backwater, drooling non-scientific ex-jugernaut. A perfect bookend to the extremeist jihadists of the east. Change indeed.

  5. I don't know if my question was answered... do we really have to pick sides? I know science and religion are not compatible... but must it be one or the other? I am not religious and I do not believe what the Bible says about creation, HOWEVER... does that mean I necessarily choose science's side then? What if there's a lot more to the universe than physical science could ever show us?

  6. Hey 12:40, the answer to your question all depends on what religion one holds. Creationists here in the US cannot hold to the findings of science (where I mean the overwhelming consensus of world scientists). Science says that the Earth is four billion years old. They believe that the Earth is only 4000-6000 yrs old. So in this case, one does have to pick a side. And I think that's kind of crazy.

    So I think I agree with you. There are plenty of other religious views that don't pit religion against science. Let's call those religions with their heads on a bit straighter.

    What if there is something more to this universe than science? How would we know? Should we even care?

  7. I would encourage everyone to read Norman geisler's book " I don't have enough faith to be an atheist". This book has definitely clarified a lot for me. But hey, that's just me. God bless America for being able to believe what I choose.

  8. I would encourage everyone to read Richard Dawkins' book "The God Delusion." That's clarified a lot for me. And after reading that, Norman Geisler is blown out of the water... Geisler is kind of an idiot though. He has no LEGITIMATE justification why Christians are the chosen people between everyone else. Seriously, he's an indoctrinated fool trying to brainwash everyone else like everyone in christian does. Imposing their own ancient rerun of morals, beliefs, and afterlife institutions on everyone else instead of accepting people. American christians tolerate everyone else but don't accept others (especially homosexuals) for what they've been so blind not to give a second thought about while someone told them the answers to universe while demanding that questioning the teachings is pointless and therefore christianity is right and god exists, nana nana boo boo. As for the creationists go: they're stupid enough to humiliate themselves without me saying a single word past calling them to attention.

    XAVIER, I hope you will like this:

    Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed. Faith is the denial of observations so that faith can be preserved. If God came from the heavens, and in-front of me, turned water into wine, I will change my mind, I will spin on a fucking dime! And when I recover from the shock, I will take a compass and carve "FANCY THAT" on the side of my cock!
    You're probly pretty pissed but I've dug this far down so I figure, in for a penny, in for a pound! Life is full of mysteries, yeah but there are answers out there and they wont be found by people sitting around, looking serious, saying "isn't life mysterious? Let's sit here and hope. Let's call up the fucking pope!" Throughout history, every mystery ever solved has turned out to be not magic. Does the idea that there might be knowledge frighten you? Does the idea that a night on wikifuckingpedia might enlighten you frighten you? Does the idea that there might not be a supernatural so blow your noodle that you just stand there in the fog of your inability to google? Isn't this beautiful, complex, wonderful, natural world enough? How does it so fail to hold our attention that we have to diminish it with the invention of cheap man-made myths and monsters?
    And if perchance I have offended, think but this and all is mended: We'd as well be ten minutes back in time for all the chance you'll change your mind.

  9. Tim Mincheon is a legend